tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3624810511475973090.post6099518342236492968..comments2023-03-31T15:29:16.240-07:00Comments on We'll get it right next time: The sophistry of libertyAndrew Rhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/09787148563535850352noreply@blogger.comBlogger4125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3624810511475973090.post-47884050300885518342007-11-26T14:11:00.000-08:002007-11-26T14:11:00.000-08:00"But to claim that I "own" my life, presumably in ..."But to claim that I "own" my life, presumably in similar fashion to... things I can buy or sell, lend or rent, donate to charity or just leave in the street... There is no meaningful way in which I can do any of the above with my life"<BR/><BR/>Not to disagree with the thrust of your argument, but:<BR/><BR/>Lend: volunteer<BR/>Rent: Have a job<BR/>Donate to charity: volunteer for charitable work<BR/>Buy/Sell: A bit trickier. Thankfully.<BR/>Leave on street: Commit suicide?<BR/><BR/>Also,<BR/>"If I get kidnapped I cease to exist in the here and now?"<BR/><BR/>I think the argument goes, you don't cease to exist (obviously), but you no longer have volition over your time; it has been stolen from you. Similar to the way murderers are described as 'stealing someones life', I guess... which I think DK goes on to say.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3624810511475973090.post-61793088329359123702007-11-26T03:31:00.000-08:002007-11-26T03:31:00.000-08:00"You own your life" means no more than that your l..."You own your life" means no more than that your life belongs to you. If your life doesn't belong to you who does it belong to? Like it or not people have been and continue to be traded as objects and consequently the distinction you make between your life and yourself is meaningless.If you do not believe that peoples lives belong to themselves on what basis would you object to slavery?<BR/><BR/>"You thought you lived in a democratic society, which had collectively decided to a) submit to the will of the electorate and b) empower the government to collect taxes to provide a safety net for poor people ,"<BR/><BR/>This phrase begs so many questions as to be almost beyond comment. Our society is not democratic in any meaningful way. Merely changing a few people at the top every four or five years, in the absence of any real difference between political parties, does not a democracy make. Ordinary people know this perfectly well which is why increasing numbers of them don't bother to vote. They know that the real power lies further down the chain with doctors, social workers, policemen and other petty officials who are not accountable to those they are meant to serve.<BR/><BR/>By poor people I presume you mean the relatively worse off, as absolute poverty disappeared some time ago.Maybe 'poor people' would prefer less interference from an overbearing state, that takes almost half their income and provides 3rd rate services in return. The fact that people on the minimum wage have to pay income tax is ridiculous, for example.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3624810511475973090.post-12926189522162844142007-11-26T03:14:00.000-08:002007-11-26T03:14:00.000-08:00You wrote: You thought you lived in a democratic s...<I>You wrote: You thought you lived in a democratic society, which had collectively decided to a) submit to the will of the electorate and b) empower the government to collect taxes to provide a safety net for poor people</I><BR/><BR/>The old 'social contract' argument. And when did we sign?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3624810511475973090.post-91212237120068855942007-11-26T01:20:00.000-08:002007-11-26T01:20:00.000-08:00All you seem to have done is put up a series of st...All you seem to have done is put up a series of straw men designed to refute liberal notions that human relations should be consensual. As for the idea of a safety net that’s the biggest straw man of the lot, why would a safety net, something which implies a minimum level of safety, necessitate statism? Do you actually want a safety net, or are you looking for something closer to equality of outcome because they are not the same thing?Mhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08204174267833645562noreply@blogger.com